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Zaheer wrote:abt 25% to 30% Of 100% men/boys show that they are doin zanjeer (showing to the world)

How do you reach to such statistical figures

This tradition came from pagans in India.
Thats what i heard...

This tradition came from pagans in India.

saff?

thats what I found out too, from some elders.

^^ The Zanjeer tradition ... not the saff..... but since you agreed on saff , then i guess both... hmmm... i think we should do some research.
Sunni's are sooo against Zanjeer and saff. they call it SHIRK.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paganism

Paganism
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"Pagan" redirects here. For other meanings, see Pagan (disambiguation)
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Paganism (from Latin paganus, meaning "a country dweller" or "civilian") is a term which, from a western perspective, has come to connote a broad set of spiritual or religious beliefs and practices of natural or polytheistic religions. The term can be defined broadly, to encompass many or most of the faith traditions outside the Abrahamic monotheistic group of Judaism, Christianity, and Islam. This group may include some of the Dharmic religions, which incorporate seemingly pagan characteristics like nature-veneration, icon-veneration, polytheism and reverence of female deities, and are thus diametrically opposite to the Abrahamic faiths. Ethnologists avoid the term "paganism", with its uncertain and varied meanings, in referring to traditional or historic faiths, preferring more precise categories such as shamanism, polytheism, or animism. The term is also used to describe earth-based Native American religions and mythologies, though few Native Americans call themselves or their cultures "pagan". Historically, the term "pagan" has usually had pejorative connotations among westerners, comparable to heathen, infidel, and mushrik and kafir (كافر) in Islam. In modern times, though, the words "pagan" or "paganism" have become widely and openly used by some practitioners of certain spiritual paths outside the Abrahamic and Dharmic religious mainstream to describe their beliefs, practices, and organized movements.[1]

qarrar wrote:

Zaheer wrote:abt 25% to 30% Of 100% men/boys show that they are doin zanjeer (showing to the world)

How do you reach to such statistical figures

Actually i was in a mini survey and what i discovered what this !! You'll say that how are u so sure that he is doin zanjeer to show of!!?? I have the answer for that but its kind of i'llegal to say here..

Zaheer wrote:Actually i was in a mini survey and what i discovered what this !! You'll say that how are u so sure that he is doin zanjeer to show of!!?? I have the answer for that but its kind of i'llegal to say here..

I am sure as long as you are not defaming anyone it should be legal. Basically don’t mentioned names or description of the person and you should be fine.

Muhammad Mahdi wrote: I am just waiting for him to come back, before I put forward to him my question and evidence.

Is sheikh Alidina back yet I have heard that he has or is planning to go back to Qum. Not sure

salaams
My apologies for the delay. I had forgotten to post the answer

He said ha when saff is being done, and a netrual person passes by and sees the saff, what would be his opinion? I the saff is such that the passerby feels that some people are lamenting and mourning then it is ok. but if the passerby sees them to be "dancing" or doing it in jest then it is not ok.

Muhammad Mahdi wrote:He said ha when saff is being done, and a netrual person passes by and sees the saff, what would be his opinion? I the saff is such that the passerby feels that some people are lamenting and mourning then it is ok. but if the passerby sees them to be "dancing" or doing it in jest then it is not ok.

What I gather from that answer is that an objective reasonable person test needs to be applied. This means when a reasonable person with no prior views or opinions about saf mataam, sees it being performed, what does he think of it?

Well when such a test is applied I see no question that a reasonable man would see it as an expression of mourning and nothing else.

I see no question that a reasonable man would see it as an expression of mourning and nothing else.

Depends

ignorant are those who thing their words are more important that mujtahids and islamic scholars. In fact such people are hypocrite..
If WOMEN looking at Men doing Zanjeer ???? is Prohibited by your marja then follow them , If they said allowed ...then obey them..

I have not seen any mujtahid prohibited this till today. Then who is this ignorant mr muhammad who do not have anyother work except to target azadari practice and defending yazeed laeen...

ws

smma 59, I was not the one started this thread. This is a forum where discussions take place.

yawwwnnnn...... morning morning, 2 people are fighting...........

smma 59, I was not the one started this thread. This is a forum where discussions take place.

GOD KNOWS WHO STARTED THIS BY THIS IS ALSO A SERIES OF ALLEGATION ON SHIA JUST TO STOP AZADARI PRACTICE.
THERE IS A BIG LIST.
AND AS I HAVE SEEN IN THIS FORUM .YOU ARE EXPERT IN THIS JOB..
IF IT WAS STARTED BY SOME OTHER PERSON. I AM REALLY VERY SORRY FOR THIS.
BY THE WAY ALLAH KNOWS THE BEST.