Ebrahim Haji Hospital - hijab friendly?

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Re: Ebrahim Haji Hospital - hijab friendly?

Postby abuali » 08 Feb 2011, 11:56

Fatimah Zahra Karim wrote:Oh, oh...brain wave! Why are the same people who're against women leaving the house and working complaining about the lack of female staff at the hospital? If they had things their way, all nurses, radiologists, gynecologists, surgeons, technicians, etc, at all hospitals would be male since in their opinion women belong at home. Booyah! :D


:D

The discussion you are referring to (viewtopic.php?f=2&t=1874&start=45) quotes Bibi Fatema (as) saying that what is best for a woman is that she does not see men and men do not see her. So it is not 'some people who are against women leaving the house and working' like you said, rather its Bibi Fatema (as) clearly setting a standard for women.

As we know from our discussion her advice has not been pondered upon let alone implemented by majority of the Muslim society.

For hospitals however, luckily Ebrahim Haji employs a lot of non-muslim staff. So female staff are not limited to muslims alone. This solves the contradiction that you seem to be indicating.

The truth of the matter is muslim females are working in those positions elsewhere anyway. We will not have to drag them out of their homes to avail this service. So why does Ebrahim Haji not have this service?
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Re: Ebrahim Haji Hospital - hijab friendly?

Postby Moonbeam » 15 Oct 2011, 23:04

Fatimah Zahra Karim wrote:1. Any blood sample that needs to be taken from the veins in the upper arm can also be taken from the veins on the back of the palm, which is what I always request when I need a sample taken. I've never known any technician to refuse this since the veins are easier to get at and there's minimal fiddling around with the needle inside.


Salaam Sister,
Would just like to thank you for giving us this idea! Believe me after having read this, every time i go for a blood test, if they tell me to put up my sleeve, i tell them to take the test from my palm and silently bless you for giving us this alternative! Ahsante sana [up] and may Allah give you every success in this world and the hereafter!
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Re: Ebrahim Haji Hospital - hijab friendly?

Postby Insaan » 24 Oct 2011, 20:43

perhaps this is the wrong forum, but apart from the issue of privacy, there are other issues with regards to ebrahim haji such as slow service, wrong medication or diagnosis resulting in death of poor patients, a 24 hour pharmacy that closes at night and so on!
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Re: Ebrahim Haji Hospital - hijab friendly?

Postby Fatimah Zahra Karim » 24 Oct 2011, 21:39

Moonbeam, you're welcome :) I'm glad I could be of use.

As for the other issues raised by Insaan
1. slow service? lol, hospitals world wide are known to have long queues. It's worse in Tz coz there's only one doc for 25000-36000 people.
2. i tried to find out about the last few patients who claimed wrong diagnosis/medication, and turned out it was just rumors. Case in point: 1 man, feeling chest pain, went to ebrahim haji. The african doc there ordered a blood test and an ecg. the ecg showed the man was having a heart attack, but the blood test was negative (those usually take a few hours to become positive, since they detect chemical leaking out of the damaged and dead heart cells). the man decided to call another ithnasheri doc employed at another hospital who told him it was nothing and that he should go home. The guy went home, and died in the middle of the night. Who gets blamed? The poor african doc at ebrahim haji.
3. there's a mini pharmacy open from 10 at night because of theft at the main pharmacy. reason? None of "our" people are willing to take a night shift and supervise the pharmacy.
Who really is to blame?
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Re: Ebrahim Haji Hospital - hijab friendly?

Postby Fatimah Zahra Karim » 24 Oct 2011, 21:48

hasin wrote:For hospitals however, luckily Ebrahim Haji employs a lot of non-muslim staff. So female staff are not limited to muslims alone. This solves the contradiction that you seem to be indicating.


No, it does not. The contradiction is that Islam is a religion meant to be universal. That means its rules and recommendations would apply and make sense even if the entire world population were muslim. Your proposition clearly does NOT make sense in such a situation and therefore fails the golden test where God says Islam is understood by reason.
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Re: Ebrahim Haji Hospital - hijab friendly?

Postby sadika » 25 Oct 2011, 18:07

Fatimah Zahra Karim wrote:Moonbeam, you're welcome :) I'm glad I could be of use.

As for the other issues raised by Insaan
1. slow service? lol, hospitals world wide are known to have long queues. It's worse in Tz coz there's only one doc for 25000-36000 people.
2. i tried to find out about the last few patients who claimed wrong diagnosis/medication, and turned out it was just rumors. Case in point: 1 man, feeling chest pain, went to ebrahim haji. The african doc there ordered a blood test and an ecg. the ecg showed the man was having a heart attack, but the blood test was negative (those usually take a few hours to become positive, since they detect chemical leaking out of the damaged and dead heart cells). the man decided to call another ithnasheri doc employed at another hospital who told him it was nothing and that he should go home. The guy went home, and died in the middle of the night. Who gets blamed? The poor african doc at ebrahim haji.
3. there's a mini pharmacy open from 10 at night because of theft at the main pharmacy. reason? None of "our" people are willing to take a night shift and supervise the pharmacy.
Who really is to blame?


1. eh isnt the nat hospital like muhimbili. thr is no reason for it to have long lines. i hv personally witnessed tat the reason for the delays is poor administration. the nurses do wat they wish and the staff are xperts @ ignoring patients if they dnt wish to deal with thm. no one can tell thm anythin!

2. thy say whr there is smoke there is fire. several dozens of patients, who r alive, have confirmed wrong diagnosis after visitin other hospitals /india /uk etc.unfortunately several 'rumours' say many who died were a result of wrong medication due to wrng diagnosis. this cannot be confirmed as no one wants their expired beloved ones to be examined. but thats nt reason enugh to discard the cases as rumours. the hospital shud investigate and take action if any wrng was done. in ur case in example wat did the eh doctor prescribe? nd why wud the family blame eh if the dctor who adviced non-action was frm another hospital? doesnt make sense.

3. again, poor admin. the management shud ensure service doesnt suffer becoz of inability to run the place. Thefts r of different kinds. wat abt the 'commissions' offered to doctors to encourage them to prescribe expensive medicine to unsuspecting patients?
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Re: Ebrahim Haji Hospital - hijab friendly?

Postby Muhammad Mahdi » 25 Oct 2011, 20:21

wat abt the 'commissions' offered to doctors to encourage them to prescribe expensive medicine to unsuspecting patients?


And you are stating this based on...?
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Re: Ebrahim Haji Hospital - hijab friendly?

Postby Fatimah Zahra Karim » 25 Oct 2011, 21:14

Well, in reference to misdiagnosis/mistreatment, you might be interested in knowing that some investigations/imaging modalities/medications are either not available here or are expensive so they are used infrequently. Diagnoses are limited by the methods at your disposal, and treatment limited by available medications and instruments.
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Re: Ebrahim Haji Hospital - hijab friendly?

Postby Insaan » 26 Oct 2011, 19:44

I also agree that the service is too slow and you have to wait for hours just because the nurses are talking to each other or are not available in their places and some of the doctors make you wait while they are on their mobiles while you are waiting for their attention hence making the next person’s turn arrive more later the usual.

I went for a tetanus injection and had to wait for hours just for a prescription from the doctor. When my turn for the ‘’blood pressure taking’’, arrived and I asked for privacy, as I couldn’t raise my sleeves in front of all the males who kept coming and going the nurse said it was not possible hence I disagreed to expose my arm and the nurse took my pressure just like that, though she fully knew that the reading wouldn’t be accurate.

What are the injection rooms for? Cant the veiled ladies blood pressure and bloodletting be taken there? Is it on the other side of the dispensary that its difficult for them to do so? No, in contrast its quiet near and its possible to do so, but they don’t want to do that. If someone tells me that they are busy with giving injections or doing dressing there, then I will say go and see for yourself. They give injection to the patients in the room they are sitting in front of other patients. When I went for tetanus injection the nurse wanted me to expose my arm there and there, where she was sitting in full view of other patients but I insisted on going inside behind the curtain. Even when I took my baligh girl for injection the nurse wanted to inject her in full view of other patients and that too on the behind. Isnt that shameful? Why is this happening in Ithnasheri dispensary???

I agree on the aspect of wrong medication too, when I took my sick child in the night due to high fever , the doc prescribed strong antibiotics and power safe injections. Thanks to Almighty that my brother who was present there, immediately called a pediatric he trusted, to ask his opinion on the medications prescribed, and he advised us that at no cost should these two medications be given together. Now didn’t the doc who prescribed know that? Or was he just trying to make us buy as many medications as possible neglecting the harmful after effects of his prescription to the health and life of the child?

I have experienced that if one isn’t careful, they prescribe tests which aren’t necessary and which they had said nothing about during consultation. I had been told to have my iron tested and it was very clear but they wrote for me full blood picture and if I had kept quiet on this as we normally do, they would have done so but I had the prescription changed in time.

Sadly nowadays, this profession isn’t as it used to be in the past where the good hearted doctors/nurses cared for the patients health ,their aim being to serve humanity .Alas nowadays, apart from a handful of the sincere doctors who have fear of God, this holy profession has been turned into money making profession in which the patients sometimes loose their all.

I also know that though many of us have complaints regarding these issues, but most of us don’t want to come forward and complain, as to begin with, we don’t know whom to present our complains with ,I have tried sometimes to write down some of the issues and put them in the suggestion box in the dispensary but haven’t seen any changes. Maybe because a handful of complaints doesn’t make any difference , so I guess we do need people power and unity to make the needed positive changes hoping that soon we can be proud of the dispensary we call OURS.
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Re: Ebrahim Haji Hospital - hijab friendly?

Postby Fatimah Zahra Karim » 26 Oct 2011, 20:29

About the hijab, true, we need to stick to our principles. Rem, these nurses are not ithnasheri. Some may not even be muslim. In their culture, it's perfectly normal to expose arms, and other parts of their bodies, so they don't understand why we're making a fuss. Time for a lil da'wah, don't you see? :)

Now, when it comes to actual medical issues, LOL! Like seriously! In reference to powerCEF and antibiotics, powercef itself IS an antibiotic called ceftriaxone. Look it up. So methinks you have your facts mixed up ;) About your Iron, yes, exactly, a full blood picture is the simplest and cheapest test to check your iron levels. If your iron levels are low, your Hb on your full blood picture would be low. In addition to that, the reading that says MCV would also be low and the PCV would also be low. Same for the MCHC. Now you might be wondering why not just do the Hb and save you some cash...not so simple. If you have folate or B12 deficiency, your Hb would also be low, but in this case, the MCV would be higher than normal, etc. Would you like another test for iron levels instead? That would involve burring a hole into your bone, getting a bit of your bone marrow and performing tests on it. More painful AND more way more expensive than that simple FBP you're complaining about. But hey, your body, your choice.
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Re: Ebrahim Haji Hospital - hijab friendly?

Postby Insaan » 27 Oct 2011, 11:48

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sis fatimah wrote,
About the hijab, true, we need to stick to our principles. Rem, these nurses are not ithnasheri. Some may not even be muslim. In their culture, it's perfectly normal to expose arms, and other parts of their bodies, so they don't understand why we're making a fuss. Time for a lil da'wah, don't you see? :)

Of course we all know that,that doesnt mean that the administration cant put rules for them to follow as they work there and are underneath them.

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sis Fatimah wrote,
  Now, when it comes to actual medical issues, LOL! Like seriously! In reference to powerCEF and antibiotics, powercef itself IS an antibiotic called ceftriaxone. Look it up. So methinks you have your facts mixed up 

sister, I am not naive that I dont know that powerCEF is an antibiotic,please reread carefully what I wrote in my post,I said the powerCEF injection was given with another antibiotics and DR KARIM himself cautioned us that both these cant be combined at any cost. Dont you think a pediatric like him is aware of the pros and cons of combining medications better then you do?

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 sis Fatimah wrote:
   About your Iron, yes, exactly, a full blood picture is the simplest and cheapest test to check your iron levels. If your iron levels are low, your Hb on your full blood picture would be low. In addition to that, the reading that says MCV would also be low and the PCV would also be low. Same for the MCHC. Now you might be wondering why not just do the Hb and save you some cash...not so simple. If you have folate or B12 deficiency, your Hb would also be low, but in this case, the MCV would be higher than normal, etc. Would you like another test for iron levels instead? That would involve burring a hole into your bone, getting a bit of your bone marrow and performing tests on it. More painful AND more way more expensive than that simple FBP you're complaining about. But hey, your body, your choice.

MashaAllah sister,I think you could be a very good doctor,that is if you arent one already.Please before advising reread my statement in which I clearly stated that in the consultation nothing was said about talking FULL BLOOD PICTURE,the doc clearly said JUST IRON TEST ,next time I will be sure to record the conversation .Also please know that I wasnt having these tests done for a first time, though I am not a medical person myself that doesnt mean that I dont have common sense.
Sis fatimah,I would like to sincerely request you to avoid being sarcastic in your arguments. Though you have full rights not to agree with a person but that doesn’t mean you can force your arguments unto others while belittling them. Believe me, you can make your posts worthwhile by using polite phrases.
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Re: Ebrahim Haji Hospital - hijab friendly?

Postby Fatimah Zahra Karim » 27 Oct 2011, 19:27

Insaan wrote:the doc clearly said JUST IRON TEST ,next time I will be sure to record the conversation .Also please know that I wasnt having these tests done for a first time

let me guess. a thallasemia/HbSS patient testing for excess iron to see if you needed chelation? That's the only place where a FBP would not make sense.
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Re: Ebrahim Haji Hospital - hijab friendly?

Postby Moonbeam » 28 Oct 2011, 13:44

Why is this happening in Ithnasheri dispensary???


Which is why it is no longer called Ebrahim Haji Ithansheri Charitable Health Centre (EHICHC) as it used to be, its only EHCHC... :confused: Convinient na?
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Re: Ebrahim Haji Hospital - hijab friendly?

Postby Moonbeam » 28 Oct 2011, 13:51

But also, other muslim women are not particular or conscious about showing off their arm for pressure or for blood taking. Therefore, when once in a while someone comes along and insists and not showing their arm, they are looked at being odd ones.

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